https://libreddit.kavin.rocks/r/TheDeprogram/comments/11s7x4u/badempanada_uyhgers_video/
Found in the Deprogram subās discussion ofnit which is quite good. Radio War Nerd also does this beating around the bush with Zenzās beliefs. To say nothing of Deprogram & RWN Russia takes,
Itās a program that impacts millions of people, there is going to be variance no matter what, and there would be āvery concernedā people who just want ānuanceā no matter what, because that variance that exists in reality will always produce at least some poor outcomes to handwring about and say you āprefer it were differentā, since nothing goes wrong in the ideal version they imagine in their head.
The bottom line is that Chinaās program is worth supporting both for the people of Xinjiang who were being terrorized and for the stability of China as a whole, and the handwringing is functionally only thinly distinguished from concern trolling when one merely speaks in vagueries about āmorally objectionable things happeningā.
If you have specific objections, name them. Otherwise, just move on instead of engaging in that absurd song and dance against imaginary dogmatists.
If you have specific objections, name them
I would say the āpossibleā (Iām honestly not quite sure how widespread it is) sterilization that mightāve produced a massive drop in birth rate is one of them
And the other is the too broad institutionalization of people based on their activities, I know theyāre not just putting people in these institutions against their will because they are muslim, there has to be other criteria, but I find it hard to believe that everyone (or maybe even most) who passes through them actually was, or had a probability of becoming, a terrorist.
And generally Iām taking a āwait and seeā approach, because intuitively I would say that this program wonāt actually end separatist terrorism (as US wars didnāt end terrorism and increased it) because of the resentment it can provoke in people in Xinjiang whoāll end up being radicalized, but there hasnāt been an attack in a while soā¦
Itās literally the āpeopleās war on terrorā and Iām not saying that as a criticism (even in a completely ideal socialist society there may be terrorism) but I do think some things can be done in the name of it that will go too far.
Regardless Iām only willing to discuss this in places like these, otherwise Iām careful not to play into anti-china propaganda
I would say the āpossibleā (Iām honestly not quite sure how widespread it is) sterilization that mightāve produced a massive drop in birth rate is one of them
I totally put off responding to this but remembered it and wanted to mention to you that IUDs would be an incredibly stupid way to conduct a āsterilizationā campaign, since itās meant to be a very temporary procedure and is thereby totally reversible. Historically we have seen what actual sterilization campaigns tend to look like (chemical castration of Ethiopians in Israel, hysterectomies on migrants in the US) and they are not the sort of thing where the victim could hypothetically go to anyone with training as a gynocologist and have it safely reversed in literally a few minutes.
It seems much more likely when one sees a large uptick in IUD insertions in a historically impoverished area where women have comparatively less autonomy to be things other than homemakers that perhaps this is something women are doing voluntarily as a product of recent development rather than due to compulsion.
And the other is the too broad institutionalization of people based on their activities, I know theyāre not just putting people in these institutions against their will because they are muslim, there has to be other criteria, but I find it hard to believe that everyone (or maybe even most) who passes through them actually was, or had a probability of becoming, a terrorist.
I think you know that this is a really nebulous claim, but itās worth noting that these people werenāt taken to Guantanamo Bay or even to a āprisonā in a recognizable sense of the word. A segment of them were imprisoned in the literal sense of the word (though with freedom to return on weekends and keep contact with the outside world), but what they were doing wasnāt breaking rocks in a quarry, it was receiving education and vocational training. For someone who was at-risk in part due to poverty or social insularity, these are not terrible things to spend a year on. Granted, that doesnāt justify just rounding up people willy-nilly, but it makes āconcernsā about not-at-risk people likewise require a little more substantiation.
Wait you believe the great replacement Uyghur sterilization theory
Lmfao this us exactly what I expect from everyone doing ānuanceā - you assume thereās something to the accusations of anticommunists who were paid to LIE
Wait you believe the great replacement Uyghur sterilization theory
I donāt believe thatās the intention in any way nor that sterilization is that prevalent.
But I thought both the declining birth rate and the presence of sterilization were both acknowledged by the government at some point no? Back in 2019 before everybody started screaming genocide the government was a lot more open about this program. Goes to show how damaging the genocide narrative is.
I would honestly appreciate an answer and I donāt mind if you just say youāre not sure, thatās at least more honest in my case
