Hexbear

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2 years ago

Zelensky himself wants to turn Ukraine into a “new Israel” with ethnic Ukrainians being in charge of an apartheid state

Where can I read more about this?

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SovereignState@lemmygrad.ml

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0 points

2 years ago

https://thegrayzone.com/2022/09/17/zelensky-nato-ukraine-big-israel/

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0 points

2 years ago

I don’t think it’s fair to say he’s advocated for apartheid based on this, just that he admires apartheid and wants to implement a police state. A lot of this article is also attributed to a Daniel Shapiro rather than Zelenskyy.

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SovereignState@lemmygrad.ml

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0 points

2 years ago

If you completely ignore all context, everything else I mentioned, and everything else Zelensky has said, sure. Zelensky has personally lauded the banning of political parties and human rights groups advocating for the rights and protections of ethnic Russians in Ukraine

https://www.middleeasteye.net/opinion/russia-ukraine-zelensky-big-israel-moscow-nervous-why

This article goes into more detail.

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0 points

2 years ago

Well I asked for reading material and what you sent me didn’t support the claim. You haven’t said anything else in this thread to establish and substantiate Zelenskyy advocating for apartheid. The article is also clear that it’s the author’s speculating and just following the trajectory. I’m not saying Zelenskyy and his government aren’t Nazis, I’m just asking for condemnation to be based on verifiable non-rescinded statements. Banning socialism and being against the people is bad enough. But publicly supporting apartheid is (I think…) going to turn public opinion against him in Europe. If it’s actually something he’s advocated I want it sourced and I want it heard by my fellow Europeans.

As a counterpoint to the narrative in the article: What else is a police state necessary to enforce? My suggestion is the suppression of communism.

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PolandIsAStateOfMind@lemmygrad.ml

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0 points

2 years ago

My suggestion is the suppression of communism.

That’s already happening in Ukraine, so it’s not what they are talking about. Also, apartheid is already in motion there too, since 2014 when they passed some bills against the russian minority and russian speaking Ukrainians. And their shock therapy especially endangerd Donbass. And they literally started to kill them when they protested. If that’s not apartheid then what it is. Zelensky is standing on a stance of victory in this war, which means Donbas would return to Ukraine - and they want to do what exactly with Donbas then? It will escalate like never before. Again, those are the people who even in middle of losing war make senseless terror strikes against civilians and even attacked Crimea.

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2 years ago

That’s already happening in Ukraine, so it’s not what they are talking about.

I’m suggesting that that could be all there is. It doesn’t have to be more. It’s illegal now and enforced because there’s a war going, but how is enforcement going to look once the country is stable?

since 2014 when they passed some bills against the russian minority and russian speaking Ukrainians

Okay, so this is what I want to know more about please.

If that’s not apartheid then what it is.

Apartheid is legal, that’s the big difference I’m getting hung up on. All the defacto apartheid in the world is going to faze most liberals because 1) They’re usually racist themselves and 2) “It’s just retaliation for the war by lone wolfs and it’s blown out of proportion”. But legal apartheid is non-refutable (lol let’s go with harder to refute).

Donbas would return to Ukraine - and they want to do what exactly with Donbas then?

Kill (kill is being used a hyperbolic synonym to abuse) Russian citizens and collaborators where there is legal framework for saying they supported an illegal invasion by Russia. Even in the case where the legal wording allows discrimination against those in the east, it wouldn’t illicit as strong a response from the European public as if the legal wording mentioned ethnicity.

Again, those are the people who even in middle of losing war make senseless terror strikes against civilians and even attacked Crimea.

This feels like you’re trying to convince me that the Ukrainian regime is nazis. I’m already onboard with that. I’m only not onboard with the assertion by SovereignState that I have been shown evidence that Zelenskyy has talked about a legally enforced apartheid system.

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