Awhile ago I downloaded several books including things like War & Peace, Sense & Sensibilities, Ulysses etc.
Some of them are quite thick, and I am wondering if I mostly did so to seem intelligent or smart on some subconscious level.
Have any of you gotten enjoyment or insight from any of these kinds of books? or is it just society and schooling that are telling me these are “good.”?
Literature (as well as art, incidentally) mostly makes sense if you think of it as a conversation between authors. When a book is considered pivotal, a classic, or otherwise very good, it usually means that it in some way moved the conversation forward and changed the way authors think about writing (to a degree, anyway).
Classics are fascinating if you want to see some of that conversation in the past, and also give you a great way to see what’s changed since then (in terms of writing skills). They’re also normally fairly interesting books because they were all popular back then.
Unless you want to study literature for years/decades, then yeah, that’s kinda what you’d be doing. But it doesn’t mean you can’t learn anything useful. And it doesn’t mean the conversation’s boring.
Problem with “the classics” is that there’s so much of em that you’ll never read the entire canon (if there’s really any value in “the canon”). That said many classics are classics for a reason, and are usually genuinely fun reads. But also don’t feel like you have to finish an 800 page tome if you’re finding it boring or dense or dry as hell. You can start shorter if you like - Portrait of the Artist rather than Ulysses, Northanger Abbey instead of Sense and Sensibility - until you get a sense of the authors and what you like.
Books are cool and good, and the more you read the more you’ll vibe it.
There are classics* that I genuinely enjoyed, classics that I didn’t enjoy but learned something from, and classics that were a total slog. If you have an interest and aren’t reading for a class, I’d say pick one that sparks your interest and give it a try, while giving yourself permission to stop reading if you’re hating it. You may be pleasantly surprised or you may decide you hate something and it’s a waste of time. Some examples from my own life: the first time I read Jane Eyre in high school, I hated it. I read it again in college and loved it. I’ve read Wuthering Heights THREE TIMES for different classes, and each time my hatred grows. FUCK those miserable people. I dreaded reading Moby Dick because it’s so fucking long and about whaling, something I had no interest in. I LOVE THAT BOOK. Read it, people. It’s so good! Edmund Spenser didn’t die soon enough and The Faerie Queene was a total slog and I hated every minute. I’m never reading that shit again. Uncle Tom’s Cabin is FULL of well-intentioned racism and sparked a lot of thoughts about white liberals for me. Is it good? I don’t know. I do think it’s important. Pride and Prejudice is a favorite and I’ve read it more times than I can count at this point.
So anyway, classics are a mixed bag, and yes, it’s possible to approach them just as a way to show off your erudition. That doesn’t mean that there’s no value in reading them though. The nice thing about reading that isn’t for a class is that there’s nothing forcing you to keep reading if you’re not getting anything out of it. I have definitely started books, decided I had no interest in continuing, and quit there and moved on with my life. So anyway, like I said before, I’d advise you to pick a book that you think sounds interesting and give it a shot.
- The question of what belongs in the canon is a whole other thing that I’m not sure I want to get in to unless you’re really interested. Minorities, feminists, etc have been working for decades to expand our idea of what even is a classic and why do we have The Canon anyway.
Totally agreed. I’ve read Crime and Punishment and found it unpleasant because it was TOO GOOD at describing feeling like shit and having a fever, which for some childish reason put me off reading The Idiot. I clearly think Dostoevsky is a very skilled author and I know that those are two different books describing different things, but I still remember feeling like I was having a fever when I read Crime and Punishment so I guess I kind of developed a phobia. If we’re looking at the Russian classics I highly recommend The Master and Margarita.
And most importantly I want to add some weight to the statement: READ MOBY DICK! It’s fantastic! I started reading it pretty much just because it was one of the classics and expected it to be a bit dry and boring, but within the first four chapters the main character is being spooned by the world’s kindest cannibal headhunter because an innkeeper made them share a bed! Also, mid-19th century whaling was legit insane and the detailed descriptions of it are anything but boring! And Moby Dick itself is a fucking kaiju or horror movie monster or something! A white whale doesn’t sound scary, but that whole bristling like a hedgehog with old harpoons that failed to kill him thing and the build-up of hearing the stories of everyone who has encountered him really works. Oh, and in the beginning when people say that Ahab is “mad” I had this idea that people were kind of casual with that word during the 19th century and he would just be a bit eccentric… But a sane man baptizes his harpoon in WHAT again?
Also, there’s a really good free audiobook version of Moby Dick on Librivox, so if you have listening time when you can’t read, use that!
just made my own comment about how good Moby Dick was, then read this and could not agree more with all points above. Part I of Crime and Punishment is kind of nauseating. I feel sweaty when I read it. Thinking about it now, I still have a sense of what Raskolnikov’s room smells like. The prose of the book also mirrors Raskolnikov’s clarity - as he regains his social support and place in the world, the writing becomes easier to digest, more leveled, as he moves from his own problems to those of others. Another Dostoevsky book that captures this well is Notes from Underground - the scene with the prostitute and the first part of C&P share the same of sort of uh, intense anxiety about everything
If you ever want to reexperience that sense of feverish anxiety, I’d recommend the Kieslowski movie a Short Film About Killing (or the episode of the Decalogue it’s taken from). For most of the first half of the movie, he blocks out part of the frame to give you that idea of immediacy, the inability to understand a situation, claustrophobia, that Raskolnikov feels leading up to the pivotal act. I’d be very surprised if it were not directly inspired by C&P
The Idiot is nothing like this. Well it is sometimes, but I loved it so much more than C&P. The best parts, for me, like any Dostoyevski books, are the those pages and pages freeing themselves from the general story and diving into one aspect, into one character’s monologue, or fantasy, or anything. The ones in The Idiot are truly a fucking blessing. And instead of being unpleasant like in C&P, they are simply freeing. Sometimes, they are deeply tortured, but it’s not the same aspect here, it goes elsewhere. Read it.
Of course there is value in reading some of the greatest literature ever. But for the love of God do not start with War and Peace or Ulysses. Start with the shorter fiction of Joyce and Tolstoy.
Ok, so I went to a college where we basically read books for 4 years, so I’ve read a decent chunk of the classics. I want to mention before I forget to that everyone has different opinions on which books are good. So the ones I’m going to suggest aren’t necessarily going to be up your alley and you might really love a book that I despise. Now, onto the suggestions:
My all-time favorite book is The Iliad. It really doesn’t get better than ancient greek epic poetry. That being said, don’t start with this. It can seem a little dry until you’re used to reading dry things. Should you decide to attempt it, read the Lattimore translation and for the love of all that is holy, just skip right over the catalogue of ships when you get there.
Oh, I should definitely recommend Grapes of Wrath and Catch-22. In high school I went through a “I have to read the classics to appear intelligent” phase and it was mostly a huge failure. I couldn’t get through Don Quixote, Moby Dick, or any of the many Shakespeare plays I started. (Except King Lear, that one was dope!) But Grapes of Wrath and Catch-22 were actually exciting enough to keep my attention. Catch-22 in particular I’ll never forget. I’d heard about it, it’s a very famous book, and I was expecting it to be dry and “deep”. But it wasn’t, it was utterly hilarious. I laughed so many times while reading it, it was just a silly romp with some war or other happening in the background. Until the last chapter, when the whole damn book gets recontextualized. It’s a masterpiece, is what I’m saying. And suuuuper easy to get into.
Other books that are good, let’s see. I really liked Middlemarch. George Elliot is like a better Jane Austen. (Also, despite her pen name being “George”, she was a woman.) I responded to you elsewhere about War and Peace, it’s really good. Someone else mentioned Candide somewhere, I agree. It’s funny, short, and makes fun of Leibniz. Classic. Someone else said Heart of Darkness sucks, hard disagree, I really liked it. It too is short and Conrad is fantastic at painting a picture with his words. Also, English is not his native language, so it’s doubly impressive. I know I said earlier I couldn’t get through Don Quixote in high school, well, I read it in college and actually really liked it. That’s not quite true; I hated the first half and loved the second half, so I’m a little hesitant to recommend it. I just felt bad for the guy in the first half. It is pretty funny though and apparently even funnier in spanish, lots of untranslateable puns and shit.
Now there are some other books I wouldn’t necessarily call “classics” that are good. Dune, for example, although the characters are really just cardboard cutouts. But the world-building is amazing and it actually really works because it’s sort of the founding myth for a civilization. Oh! How could I forget Charles Dickens? A lot of his stuff is good, but I’m going to recommend A Tale of Two Cities. Yes, it’s like his most famous book, but I think there’s a reason for that, it’s damn good. Really makes you feel for the characters. Also, if you’ve never read The Hobbit or Lord of the Rings, do that. Sure, the morality is a little black and white for my taste and there are hints of racism with how the humans from the south and east are portrayed, but still, it’s a good time.
And lastly, I will never not recommend anything and everything by Ursula K LeGuin. Most especially Left Hand of Darkness. And if you’re feeling up to a little philosophy and political theory sprinkled into your sci-fi adventure, The Dispossessed is super fucking good. In a similar vein (although I like him less) you can’t go wrong with Asimov. His Foundation series in particular is quite good.
Ok, well, now that I’ve basically written a novel for you to read, I’ll stop. Good luck in your reading adventures comrade! And if you ever just don’t like a book, stop reading it, even if other people think it’s life-changing or earth-shattering or whatever. Not every book is for every person.
