I had basically given up on electoralism for years at this point.
I do not believe the western working class by and large has any revolutionary potential, basically JDPON-pilled.
But the genocide in Palestine really made me more invested in this whole dog and pony show again.
I guess I figured like…sure bourgeoise democracy will not bring about socialism, but at the very least you can still get some concessions potentially out of it.
Perhaps I was naive, but like…I wanted to hope there was some way the Democrats could be convinced to stop it by November, even if it was electoralist bullshit I feel like the Palestinians deserved (and still deserve) even a futile attempt.
But seeing the shit with the DSA, especially the SMC and Groundwork caucuses, seeing unions who oppose the genocide endorse Biden/Harris right out the gate, seeing the Uncommitted movement do the same while the Harris campaign has done nothing but spit in their face….
I am filled with a helpless rage. Americans are the most pathetic contemptible creatures on this earth.
I’M NOT EVEN ASKING FOR SOCIALISM! ALL I’M ASKING FOR IS THE DEMOCRATS TO COME AROUND ON AN ISSUE 77% OF DEMOCRATS AND 61% OF AMERICANS OPPOSE!
BUT EVEN THAT IS TOO MUCH, TOO HARD FOR THESE ORGANIZATIONS TO FIGHT FOR EVEN WHEN IT IS ALLEDGELY THEIR WHOLE REASON FOR EXISTING!!
I knew Americans were useless and selfish, and short-sighted and stupid…but I didn’t think they were to this extent.
That was my mistake I guess.
I got out of the DSA over the Palestine stuff early this year. I can’t say I don’t miss the party life but it’s nice not being in a Zionist and all around opportunist org.
I also had some revelations about the big unions at the end of last year and yeah we’re all around fucked unless the US left starts figuring some shit out real quick.
Sorry you’re going through this. It isn’t fun. There’s at least a few others with you though.
The older I get, the more I understand Stalin’s purges and the Cultural Revolution in China. I have read zero Mao and have become a Third World Maoist anyway because of all the shit that goes on in the US.
my hottest take is that america will definitely need a cultural revolution if we ever overthrow the government.
it will need multiple, I legit cannot imagine a functioning socialist state in america without literally destroying it
It is no measure of health to be sane in an insane world
I think it might be different if there were any viable third party candidate to rally around. It’s hard to protest Harris over Palestine when like, Trump would be worse. Probably not much worse, but still hard to gin up any enthusiasm about it.
the point is to have enough people threaten to withhold their vote unless something is done by the election, it doesn’t matter if there is a viable third party it only matters that Harris will lose Michigan and/or other states.
There’s a scene in seven psychopaths where someone points a gun a Christopher Walken and tells him to put his hands up, and Walken just casually says “no”, and the other guy gets confused and frustrated. That’s how it feels threatening to withhold votes from the Democratic party.
All due respect, and with the understanding that I’m not a brilliant political strategist. Can you explain how we get from point A (threaten to withhold votes) to point B (a positive outcome in Palestine)?
If Harris and the democrats fear they will lose crucial swing states and potentially the election because of what is happening in Palestine then they might be convinced to change course.
Unfortunately, in America we can’t within the current system. Reform or revolution? (Revolution)
Here’s another lib who thinks you shouldn’t protest someone over genocide because hypothetically Trump would be worse.
Do you still believe they’re bitter enemies even though Kamala called Trump after the latest sad excuse for a shooter and condemned political violence? They’re more like the face and heel in pro wrestling than anything.
I don’t think they’re enemies. I think their policies on Israel would be nearly identical, except Trump would be slightly more corrupt and incompetent. It’s just hard to threaten to withhold a vote when there’s no alternative.
there are alternatives, and withholding votes might get democrats to, yknow, fucking change their position in order to woo voters? Thats the whole point of compromise? seriously do i have to tell libs about how their own shitty ‘democracy’ works?
unless he wins a state by one vote, it makes no difference. If he wins by multiple votes, specifically due to low turnout from low enthusiasm for Harris, then it’s her fault as a candidate for not appealing to the electorate.
You’re right that their policies on Israel would be nearly identical. The point is that they don’t have to be. OP pointed out that 77% of Democrats and 61% of Americans support ending the genocide, why isn’t she listening?
I think their policies on Israel would be nearly identical, except Trump would be slightly more corrupt and incompetent
wow so trump is the harm reduction candidate
viable third party candidate
There are, but to liberals “third party” means “unviable”
hard to protest Harris over Palestine when like, Trump would be worse. Probably not much worse, but still hard to gin up any enthusiasm about it.
skill issue?
I think it might be different if there were any viable third party candidate to rally around.
The vast majority of USians live in a state where there’s only one viable candidate. Voting for Harris in Alabama, Texas, or Florida is as pointless as voting for De la Cruz, so you might as well vote for the candidate who doesn’t want to exterminate all Palestinians.
The Democrats simply must be destroyed. Both parties must be destroyed but I think the democrats must go first. A party built on this goal is necessary but dangerous and inherently subversive to the point of probably being illegal in some way
