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This is, and always will be, the only content I will consume by the Podcaster Known As Virgil Texas. I love this piece hahahaha
That article is a fucking masterpiece. The first time I read it, I had never heard of chapo and I had to struggle to finish it because I was laughing so hard.
Now everything is just sad because hellworld
Honestly, same exactly experience hahaha except I still find it pretty funny, tbh. But more in a ‘look at this hero, I guess I should probably be doing this too’ sort of way lmao
He’s the lead sound technician of chapo.chat’s official podcast!
They generally don’t have infighting […] dissenters over even trivial things are treated poorly
I found that contradictory at first, but … does this mean the only reason they don’t have infighting is that they all avoid subjects that are controversial within the group? Because that would be in line with what i’ve seen so far - that right unity is just a flimsy facade and that such groups could easily be split if you give them a wedge subject they can’t avoid / ignore.
They don’t have infighting because the moment someone disagrees on even a minor thing they don’t have a “struggle session” over it, they just kick/drive them out.
The chud worldview conflates weakness, poorness, being low in the kyriarchy, and moral failing/degeneracy. They basically all agree on this. The biggest structural difference is a split between “we should act morally, and let the degenerates get what’s coming to them” and “we must act to protect ourselves from the degenerates.” You might be able to manufacture some sort of argument there.
There’s also the exact structure of the kyriarchy, but I don’t really think you’re going to get a community-splitting argument out of who’s more inferior, a black person or a trans person. (They do argue about that stuff though.)
No, but you can (and I have) caused rifts in these communities over whether certain European nationalities count as white.
In my experience, yes. They don’t discuss things that isn’t unanimous among their peer group… basically: less immigration, lower taxes, more patriotism.
Way easier to come to a consensus around those things than actually changing concrete things that may have 5/10/20 different ways to fix things, like is the case among our peer group.
that right unity is just a flimsy facade and that such groups could easily be split if you give them a wedge subject they can’t avoid / ignore.
Such as? You could wrap class grievances (against your boss, for example) in right-wing drivel pretty seamlessly, and that could (a) drive a wedge between the free market capitalism nerds and the people who are just there because they’re poor and racist, and (b) at least create some potential for those who leave to be receptive to leftist ideas. It might also sow the seeds for deprogramming the Trump cult of personality. There are already people who say they don’t like Trump personally but they like what he does, and throwing an “eat the rich” spin can probably sneak by without raising too much suspicion.
Somebody liked your post so much that your post has been awarded ChapoChat Gold™
Excellent idea!
Also, being inside a white-supremacist group gives you some opportunities to pull people out. Two of the tricks I use over on 4chan:
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Give correct explanations of left-wing/feminist views while sneering at said views. Make the views look good, but yourself on the chuds’ side, and yourself look awful. (Correct explanation of the kyriarchy and how it keeps people down, which is a good thing, because fuck equality, I want to be on top)
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Look for newbie-nazis looking for advice on how to pull themselves slightly further in (inferior culture -> inferior people -> we need to look out for our race -> races need to keep to themselves -> we need to deport other races -> that’s too hard lets just kill them), and instead give them the most direct and awful version possible (skip to the genocide). This scares the newbies off, and they have a chance of landing in a leftwing pipeline instead.
On 4chan you can do both because it’s anonymous. You’d probably need separate accounts for this to work in spaces with names. I’d lean towards just using the first one, but I’m not an expert on facebook nazis.
Look for newbie-nazis looking for advice on how to pull themselves slightly further in (inferior culture -> inferior people -> we need to look out for our race -> races need to keep to themselves -> we need to deport other races -> that’s too hard lets just kill them), and instead give them the most direct and awful version possible (skip to the genocide).
Speaking of newbie-Nazis, /r/Libertarian is a great place to scare them away from going full-on fascist. The libertarian-to-fascist pipeline is real, the community is large enough to get some bang for your posting buck, it’s easy and fun to dunk on a joke ideology, and there’s a fairly established subgroup of posters there who are either on the left or at least sympathetic to it. Plus, they don’t ban you even if you quote Marx, so you don’t have to bother too much with sneaking around. You can just openly describe how hellish a libertarian utopia would be (your “skip to the genocide” strategy).
The legitimate ideological openness of that sub also facilitates your first point, but even more directly: you can just give a leftist alternative and describe how it’s good; you don’t even need to wrap it in a chud veneer. Sometimes an easy, clearly-better alternative is the most convincing argument against something.
I’ve had a lot of luck directly recruiting libertarians, they’re actually the group I’ve had the most success with. You can usually get them to entertain the difference between private property and personal property, and if you spend a couple months paying attention to that then suddenly you’re a socialist. And explaining the difference between modern unions and historic radical unions (casting all anti-union propaganda as the fault of modern unions being small) works super well on libertarian tech-bros.
I’ve just stopped talking about private property at all except when someone specifically uses it. I usually just say “private ownership of the shit we need to make shit”. I guess it probably depends who you’re talking about.
I have the exact opposite experience of talking to libertarians unfortunately. It gives me some hope that you’ve had some success with them though.
The libertarians I deal with are those weird ones that overly criticize “liberals” and leftists at the drop of a dime but shrivel up and piss themselves when I deconstruct IDW bullshit or mildly push back reactionary rhetoric. These two people revolve their anti-govt attitude around George Orwell (one is obsessed with 1984 and nothing else), Ayn Rand and Thomas Sowell. Throw in the typical IDW guy videos and they become this impenetrable wall of libertarian horseshit that is almost impossible to deconstruct.
I’m not really even trying to “recruit” or convert any of them. I just get caught up in being an online guy (I mean we’re posting here ffs lol) and sometimes can’t help but fight back against the bullshit.
I probably need a new approach but god damn it is tiring
I suppose this is where I came from. Though, I never thought ill of women, POC, or LGBT+ so maybe I was just always a socialist and didn’t have the right ‘language’ for it.
I’ve had a lot of luck directly recruiting libertarians, they’re actually the group I’ve had the most success with.
They’re on the upper end of the pipeline to fascism, which makes them among the easiest to turn away.
You can usually get them to entertain the difference between private property and personal property, and if you spend a couple months paying attention to that then suddenly you’re a socialist.
This is a good entry point. Two other ones I’ve had luck with are:
- The sub is focused on capitalism far more run-of-the-mill conservative subs (and certainly more than white nationalist groups), so critiquing the places where capitalism fails most egregiously fits in pretty naturally. You don’t have to be the “but the real problem, of course, is capitalism” guy all the time because they’re discussing it so fucking much already.
- They spend a lot of time re-litigating whether we need public schools or public courts (lol) and there are just overwhelmingly good arguments for all of that stuff and more. You get lots of space to put those arguments out there, so anyone dipping their toes in and thinking “my public school wasn’t great; maybe we should just privatize all of this” can get connected with why that’s a horrible idea.
Besides derailing fascist pipelines, there’s also the benefit of sharpening your own critiques of capitalism (and your own alternative solutions).
Nope! I don’t screenshot and these things naturally disappear after a while. I’ve been meaning to sponsor a community raid at some point, so I’ll make sure to get examples when doing that.
I’ve actually seen a lot less opportunity for #2 on /pol/ for the last several months; there’s a lot fewer newbie-nazis.
Here’s a post I did just now that I’m pretty happy with though (this is more of a #3 - stating leftist views in a way palatable to chuds). Unfortunately I didn’t manage to get first response, so it’s pretty unlikely to draw serious attention. (The OP is confused because racism doesn’t explain animosity between Greece and Turkey, which of course it doesn’t, because racism is just something people made up 400 years ago, and most prejudice historically was very local. But I can’t just say that without them deciding I’m an SJW and ignoring me.)
