There is a lot of answers but if I’d say just one it would be rejecting the current institutional power. At least right now in our time period. Fully rejecting the imperial state, no matter how much they potentially benefit from it seems like a solid transition
we are all lib so let’s not gatekeep what leftist™️ actually is. I guarantee you were a lib once too(still are, but once too.)
People are giving examples but generally you need to push through the first firm contradiction of capitalism, whatever that might be for someone. Maybe it’s something dealing with our ability and unwillingness to house the homeless.
The point is that, once that have that contradiction resolved or even just in mind, they will begin becoming frustrated with seeing libs ignore it, constantly. They will start seeing contradictions in more places and be more open to leftist analysis
you need to push through the first firm contradiction of capitalism
This cannot be overstated. If you support capitalism in any form or function, you are not capable of truly seeing the systemic damage it is causing around the world. Capitalism is the root cause of our suffering.
When I tried to make this point, repeatedly, in an /antiwork thread, I was constantly met with “yes but have yuo considered CAPITALISM GOOD and YOU TANKIE BAD?”
I know better than to argue with :reddit-logo: but I was hoping the message might get through to someone
:rosa-salute:
For me, sticking around on Radlib subs back in the day, seeing “Tankies” getting downvoted but none of their arguments concretely addressed helped the seed of doubt in my mind to sprout. It may not be much but it adds up. It’s why I don’t want to fully give up on :reddit-logo: even though I find myself taking breaks often for mental health’s sake.
I find myself taking breaks often for mental health’s sake.
That’s the trick. Taking breaks from that hellsite has significantly improved my mental health. Additionally, I have curated my :reddit-logo: feed so that I’m not exposed constantly to the worst lib takes, and if I am, it’s only to roast them for being the dipshits that they are
I gotta say I’ve only had it work once (on my wife) and it took so long that I would never even dip my toes into trying to talk to someone on :reddit-logo: ever again. And I used to tolerate discussing atheism with anonymous folks (I know)
But I will continue getting my friends there and, hopefully someday, my community :sicko-biker:
Honestly? They need to experience genuine loss at the hands of capitalism. My turning point was the death of my brother years ago, and losing my career after more than a decade of being a good drone. All in service of profits and “fiscal responsibility”. So how much money did ending his life save? How many pennies did you scrape together by devastating my family’s livelihood?
Any liberal forced to answer hard questions like that will either turn into a ride-or-die communist, or they were already a piece of shit ghoul.
Solidarity bud. I definitely think there is a strong correlation with suffering at the hands of this wretched machine and becoming more politically conscious about how the system truly works. Its a shame leftist ideology isn’t more mainstream because there would be so many people more on board with it if they actually knew anything about it. A popular guiding hand would be huge
For me it was a combination of Bernie getting fucked over and looking around and realizing that making things safe and equitable for everybody wasn’t the center of all the other lib’s politics.
Plus the Chapo episode where they just dunk on the West Wing for an hour.
I think some people look around and have that “how is no one else seeing this?” moment and are willing to consider solutions to problems outside of electoralism and symbolic protest
I think some people look around and have that “how is no one else seeing this?”
IDK that sounds like most of my life since I was 12 at pretty much anything my deluxe boomer parents and their boomer society did/said/saw on fox news/etc…
I had maybe three months of being a liberal after college when I told myself it was “time to grow up and accept reality as it is.” That ended as soon as I started working in an office.
But that’s not because I was too clever for liberalism or something - I just always hated people who acted like they had all the answers. If anything, my distaste for them was a little reactionary. I called myself an “anarchist” as a teen, but that really just meant I didn’t like cops and I thought voting was dumb. I didn’t really hold any true political beliefs back then.
But my tipping point was having to do unethical work during unpaid overtime hours. It was pretty immediate - I think I found r/cth through people complaining about y’all, and that is when I first found a tribe where I could talk about these things and work my beliefs into something more coherent. So yeah, I guess technically I got radicalized by a podcast I never listened to.
I’ll also add that I’ve been somewhat disillusioned with leftist communities lately, as well. There is so much anger and distrust towards the American political establishment right now, and all we do is make fun of these people for being “so close” without figuring it out.
We all ought to spend more time in communities where people don’t share our beliefs. Be open about the fact that you’re a communist, but don’t argue when people complain about it and don’t announce it at the start.
I’ve found a surprising amount of support when I make Marxist takes in plain language. Usually after several people agree, some guy will be like “uh that’s communism,” and that’s your opportunity to say, "Yes, I’m a communist. You’re absolutely free to disagree with my views. I just think that the current system is pitting us against each other so a few rich guys can get even richer. " Emphasize the division rhetoric because libs eat that shit up.
For some reason, the person typically sees this non-confrontational response and can’t help but go on an 800 word rant hitting every major anti-communist trope. Don’t take the bait. If you have to respond, just smile and shrug with an “Agree to disagree!”
Congrats, you’ve just shown everyone else in the room that the communist is the civil one. I’ve been playing with this tactic a lot lately and it is amazing how quickly people turn on the aggressor. Libs really care so much more about how you deliver the message than the substance of the message. That’s all it takes to get a foot in the door.
From there, you’ve gained the credibility to start propagandizing in earnest. You never want to seem like you’re trying to convince anybody - like the liberals, you have to pretend that simply holding the right moral beliefs is enough. Talk about the material conditions, but use moralism to hammer your points home. Use lib-friendly quotes from your favorite works of theory, and when they ask about it, offer to lend them a book. If someone picks up on what you’re doing, it’s back to step one: “Whoah, I thought we were just having a conversation. I know I’m not going to change your beliefs and you’re not going to change mine, so why don’t we move past this?”
Basically, I think that we need a new set of dirtbag tactics that rely less on edgy comedy and more on Machiavellianism. Never talk to these people in good faith, but always keep up the appearance. Earn their trust. Once they come to you with questions, then you can start a more honest dialogue.
How does one not take the bait, especially when the bait is very annoying? How do I learn this self control?
You think how much you would annoy them by appearing just nice human bean, with a plus of being nice human bean
