the myopic reductionist view of ‘thing bad’ is a tad fucked when you are comparing the worst crime of the industrial era to a leader you dislike

Hog out or log out liberal

😤

what use is politics if you never mean to take power. the point is not merely to discuss the world but rather to change it.

Honest socialism is more shown to be shut down by external forces, meanwhile fascism disguising as socialism and using fascism protection as an excuse continue

I don’t think you understood the lesson the other person was trying to convey. The Sandinistas (for example) were “honest socialists” but they found, despite having no intention of employing such measures at first, that they needed intelligence agents (called “secret police” if it is a country you don’t like) in order to root out infiltrators and saboteurs. That does not make them “fascists in disguise” but merely “people who wanted not to succumb immediately to capitalist encirclement”

If those spam comments have been dunks it’s tough to see how I can be seen as pro-USA, that isn’t democracy either

It’s a bourgeois democratic republic but anyway the point is that when you denounce the US but also denounce nearly all of its opposition (with the same term, no less) to an audience of westerners, you are mainly contributing to undermining solidarity with the imperial periphery against western imperialism, which should be a primary concern to those living in the imperial core.

Honest socialism is more shown to be shut down by external forces, meanwhile fascism disguising as socialism and using fascism protection as an excuse continue

That’s not at all what I’m saying, I’m saying exactly what @GarbageShoot@hexbear.net is saying; that the Sandinistas (for example) were “honest socialists” but they found, despite having no intention of employing such measures at first, that they needed intelligence agents (called “secret police” if it is a country you don’t like) in order to root out infiltrators and saboteurs. That does not make them “fascists in disguise” but merely “people who wanted not to succumb immediately to capitalist encirclement”.

What I think the miscommunication is is that I think you consider the Sandinistas distinct from Chinese Socialism, Vietnamese Socialism, Soviet Socialism, etc. No. They were the exact same. You only don’t feel hatred towards the Sandinistas because they have not been the direct target of Amerikkkan propaganda for many decades. What I’m saying is that you are not immune to propaganda, despite thinking that you are, and that the only real distinction between socialist societies deemed “authoritarian” and ones that are not is that “authoritarian” are the target of active propaganda. You’re propagandized, and you are so propagandized you do not realize you are.

A KGB spy and a CIA agent meet up in a bar for a friendly drink. “I have to admit, I’m always so impressed by Soviet propaganda. You really know how to get people worked up,” the CIA agent says. “Thank you,” the KGB says. “We do our best but truly, it’s nothing compared to American propaganda. Your people believe everything your state media tells them.” The CIA agent drops his drink in shock and disgust. “Thank you friend, but you must be confused… There’s no propaganda in America.”