this is the guy they smear as authoritarian lmao
They promised he would have gulags up and running! Fucking tories lying about all the cool shit :angery:
:long-corbyn: deserved better than Terf-island even with this take.
These vaccine mandates have broken the minds of so many left boomers, literally the only people that take issue with this are reactionaries
Anglo* left boomers
Boomers anywhere else in the world (and I mean chuds too) have mostly zero problems with vaccine mandates.
Stupidity do be horizontal sometimes.
I guess this obsession with “individual rights” is mostly an Anglo phenomenon (and in non-Anglo countries where it is present, it’s likely the consequence of Anglo colonialism & imperialism). But yeah, it’s sad how many people fall for this.
I’m surprised by all the vaccinated anglos who are against it because “freedom”.
I would think that people would not give a shit if they’re vaccinated but I guess not.
It’s not even the rabidly antivax against it, but the inbetweeners who got it only because the passports and job consequences and would otherwise skip it; the kind of people who don’t get a flu shot every year and are generally ambivalent.
I see it in a lot of New age hippie types as well, but they were somewhat anti vac before COVID even started. I can see there being a few old hippies in Jezza’s social circle that led him to saying this shit
I know some people who work at a hospital, and anecdotally, they said that of the dozens of routine antivax staff (which is just insane at a hospital of all places), literally every single one of them got the vaccine once they were given an ultimatum.
Mandates work, and it’s especially crucial that healthcare workers of all people be required to be vaccinated for reasons I shouldn’t have to elaborate on. They should not be allowed to put patients and their coworkers at risk, period.
Nah. Jez is right on this one.
We’re going to be fighting this fight for years to come. This just hands a win to antivax and antimaskers who are a pipeline directly into fascism. It’s very tempting to believe you’re doing good because you think you’re saving lives in the near-term but that’s not the case if your decision making is shortsighted.
If you hand easy wins to these movements you’re just going to make it harder and harder to get compliance out of people in the covid variant we’ll be dealing with 4 years from now. It is essential to build voluntary compliance and the collective desire of the population to do it because it’s the right thing to do.
This will look very different from the American perspective I suspect because you’ve got much bigger problems with collective voluntary vaccination than we do as a more heavily atomised society with far less population density.
Everyone is focused on the here and now with some misplaced belief that covid can be defeated, it can’t, it is not going to be defeated under capitalism. We have to factor it into analysis and have a further-reaching analysis of action against it, we need the whole of society to collectively agree to living in combat with it and handing wins to reactionaries will make that harder.
Yes and every single time you mandate it you send more people into the movement, participating in the online misinformation, into Q circles, and into street protests.
They’re not too hard to deal with right now. But they are growing at a rate that is fast enough to be a real concern. It is far easier to beat these people with social pressures of friends, family and the collective pressure of society than it is via authoritarian pressure.
The authoritarian methods should be used only when they can in fact achieve a guaranteed win. In this case we’re just sending more people into the “muh freedom muh liberties” fascist movement that is growing in the UK. It plays right into the hands of a social vs fascist cultural split in society.
There are very few vaccinated antivaxers. The best way to cut down their recruitment pool is to push people to get vaccinated now before they can be indoctrinated with antivax insanity. Anecdotally, a nurse I know says many of her colleagues aren’t vaccinated, but will get it because of the mandate. It’s not radicalising them, it’s having the intended effect.
Yes and every single time you mandate it you send more people into the movement, participating in the online misinformation, into Q circles, and into street protests.
Honest question: is there any evidence for this? I know anecdotes aren’t data, but most anti-vaxers I know who were forced to do it just got mad online for a day and then got the shot.
i know its painful to admit but the vaccines just don’t work very well. they were rushed out by project warp speed, a combo pentagon/big pharma operation. they slightly reduce the severity of a case but do not stop transmission. their effectivness falls off drastically after a few months. natural immunity is by all accounts much more robust and life long. if you are high risk you can take the vaccine. if you just want to be careful you can take the vaccine. if you are in good health, with no pre existing conditions it should not be compulsory because the jab will not stop transmission.
Vaccines are not 100% effective, but you’re overstating the strength of natural immunity. We have no way of knowing that it’s “life long”, only that it seems to be longer lasting than vaccine immunity. Vaccines don’t completely stop transmission, and neither does previous infection. Unvaccinated people that have recovered are still contributing to spreading the virus, and they could reduce that by getting the vaccine.
We have a lot of evidence now that shows that the vaccines are effective at reducing the spread. They’ve been shown to reduce the risk of infection, accelerate viral clearance, reduce transmission, and have high efficacy against severe infection, hospitalization, and death. A thread on some of the weaknesses of natural immunity. Also, contrary to what many libertarians would have us believe, even most Americans do actually support vaccine mandates.
Worth noting this is specifically for frontline NHS workers, who are already required to get mandatory vaccinations for Hep B.
I was going to riff on TrashFuture’s line about “the only thing we can do is the impossible” and suggest mandatory vaccination nationally is just totally not going to happen when we’re having this much trouble with voluntary vaccination.
But for NHS workers specifically? Jesus fucking Christ.
